Garden inspiration permalink
Nighmare garden - where to start?
This discussion has been closed.
-
Message 1.Â
Posted by PatP (U14831146) on Monday, 4th April 2011
My daughter and partner have just bought their first house which is a little terraced in Leeds. Unfortunately apart from a tiny back yard, the back garden is banked very steeply - maybe 60 degrees, starting from a 5' wall. It does however level out a little at around 20' high which could be made into a small level patio area. I love my garden and usually have lots of ideas, but I am really stumped as to how they could even begin to try to do something with this. I would love for them to be able to do something with it this year to enable them to be able to enjoy the summer (other than going to their local park) and would be prepared to 'lend' them a bit of capital to give them a budget to get some help to turn it into something nice and more importantly, usable. Their budget wouldn't be vast - maybe a couple of thousand pounds which would probably be completely used up in labour, before we even thought about design costs and materials. I wondered if there was any way of getting this project picked up by a gardening design student who might really enjoy a challenge - or even a college who might like to take on something like this as a learning or assessment scheme? If anyone has any good ideas I would really (really) appreciate any help offered.
-
Message 2
Posted by kfgray (U14470933) on Monday, 4th April 2011
Get some mates in and some railway sleepers. Not the used ones nasty chemicals in them. Drill holes each end you can hire big drills and dive in some stacks to make terraces, start at the buttom. It is a about 3 weekends work I would think but then again I can dig for hours (must have been a mole in a past life). this may be a usefull link to give an idea
-
Message 3
Posted by PatP (U14831146) on Monday, 4th April 2011
Many thanks for your response - I will certainly pass it on - and see if they can recruit some help with a bit of encouragement of 'filthy lucra' (or money as is sometimes known)
))
Just checking ... but I am supposing that you build the stack to maybe 2 or 3' then backfill from above - and then repeat ???
Cheers
Pat -
Message 4
Posted by daintiness (U3887838) on Monday, 4th April 2011
Definitely will need to be terraced. You have quite a few gardening colleges in your area so it maybe worth approaching them for ideas/enthusiastic designers -failing that google terraced/terracing a garden and there should be lots of info, images and instructions.
Also look out from the upstairs windows and see what the neighbours have done. If you see a good garden design it would probably be worth knocking on the door to see who did the work - usually gardeners are only too happy to help with giving others a leg up. -
Message 5
Posted by Joe_the_Gardener (U3478064) on Tuesday, 5th April 2011
PatP,
How wide is the back-yard before the slope starts? -
Message 6
Posted by Papa Nopsis (U14479902) on Tuesday, 5th April 2011
Jersey potatoes!
Any chance of a photo for us to help deliberate? -
Message 7
Posted by PatP (U14831146) on Tuesday, 5th April 2011
Hi,
Thanks for your response. None of the neighbours have tackled this problem, or if they have it was a long time ago and fallen back into ruin (I can see evidence of attempted and/or ruins of terracing). Not quite sure who you mean when you say there are a few gardening colleagues in the Leeds area - do you know of any I could contact? Logistically the job looks so very daunting - I think first thing will be to try to establish some sturdy steps up the bank to access the little plateau at the top and then lots of digging and levelling, which will probably need to be managed by someone who knows what they are doing. I think it would be an ideal project for a student needing an assessment assignment in this field! -
Message 8
Posted by PatP (U14831146) on Tuesday, 5th April 2011
Hi Joe,
Thanks for your response. The back yard is is an upside down 'L' shape with a narrow bit, maybe 5' wide, beside the kitchen extension,> This widens to perhaps 12' when the extension ends, for about 6 ' before the bank/wall begins. The wall supporting the bank is around 5' high, is made of stone and looks pretty loose and unstable. The bank continues from the top of the wall at about 60 degrees until around 20' high where it flattens out to a small plateau which is bordered by a further wall of about 20' which ends at the end of the garden of the houses above. (have I lost you now???). I have asked my daughter for some pics and will get them uploaded as soon as I get them. The level of the plateau looks to be roughly the height of the first floor of the house (or kitchen extension roof). I am tempted to explore the idea of linking them all together as a kind of walkway! (I sometimes get a little over ambitious
Hope this helps - keep the ideas coming)) -
Message 9
Posted by PatP (U14831146) on Tuesday, 5th April 2011
I have indeed requested a photo and will upload it asap. As a first desperate measure I have given them a box of wild flower seeds and suggested if nothing else, they scatter this over the existing weeds and brambles currently over running the whole area. They did dig it all over last year but it has all grown back again now.
-
Message 10
Posted by Papa Nopsis (U14479902) on Tuesday, 5th April 2011
did dig it all over last year but it has all grown back again Â
Now dig and weed it all over again! Before you cast the wildflowers!
It sounds quite exciting a s a garden prospect!
It may be a local stone dry stone wall, which may not be as unstable as it looks.
Can you get a mini-digger round there? (that's ambitious)
Which side of the house is all that on? Is it on the south side or the north/e/W side? It makes a big difference to the creative effort you are going to put in to it.
If you are not sure, watch how much sun it gets per day, and at what times,and report back!!!
Does this below mean the houses above are about 40' above? ::
The bank continues from the top of the wall at about 60 degrees until around 20' high where it flattens out to a small plateau which is bordered by a further wall of about 20' which ends at the end of the garden of the houses above (like Swansea/Wales housing terraces?!)
If you can create a walkway up and down and none exists at the moment, then that must be a good idea. You might have to dig in to a heavy chalk/clay bank, but if it were only a short length it might be very well worthwhile.
How about arming yourself with a surveyor's tape measure?
The plateau sounds as though it might be useful. How wide is it? -
Message 11
Posted by daintiness (U3887838) on Tuesday, 5th April 2011
Hi PatP Leeds City College and Metropolitan Uni. run and RHS Harlow Carr all run design/gardening courses. It might help a young person to put a design together or use it for their portfolio ... worth a phone call or an email or two.
-
Message 12
Posted by Papa Nopsis (U14479902) on Tuesday, 5th April 2011
Also if you are any good at webtechno, there is a free design software program somewhere, RHS website perhaps?
Designing my own garden, as i am at the moment, I rather think that the mind's eye is the best way of doing it, but if all three of you are going to put in ideas, an objective record may be essential.
When people come in to my garden they say "Why don't you...?" and then I realize what I ought to do, could do, or will do, usually depending on the cost ie nil!
Chucking money at something may not be good, but hard labour might! That in itself might cost money. Manual labour at the moment ? £12/hr? -
Message 13
Posted by Joe_the_Gardener (U3478064) on Wednesday, 6th April 2011
PatP,
Thanks for that - I'll have a think about it later, when I've got more time. Just to check - you say that the slope is 60%; that is pretty steep, any terrace construction on it would be quite demanding. What's the distance from your backyard to the 20ft wall supporting the gardens of the houses above. Which direction does the bank face? From the point of view of sunshine it would be an advantage if it was southwards, in order to grow things, but it might be disadvantageous to what follows as what I'm about to suggest could reduce the light on your yard and kitchen extension.
It may be that your five foot wall at the back of the yard doesn't support anything much, but is mainly decorative. It may retain a bit of loose soil; do you get much drainage onto the yard from the bank?
I've been thinking initially about a deck supported by posts founded on the yard at the foot of the bank. The posts would be high enough to give you a level deck that meets the bank some way up the slope. Your deck might be on a level with the first floor of your house. Where the deck meets the slope it would need to be firmly anchored. Access would be by stairs up to the deck.
This would be quite a substantial building job, but nothing that a builder with a bit of common sense couldn't do.
Have you investigated (by digging trial holes) to see what the bank is made of? If it's a good soil over solid rock or other stable geology it should be OK; any sign of local landslides!
Joe -
Message 14
Posted by Papa Nopsis (U14479902) on Wednesday, 6th April 2011
You can spend as much building a garden as you can a house eh joe?!
-
Message 15
Posted by Paul N (U6451125) on Wednesday, 6th April 2011
Pat
Please don't take offense at my questions but what do your daughter and partner want from a garden? Do they both have busy working lives and won't find time to garden anyway? If they like gardening, why did they buy a house with such a difficult plot? I know when we bought our house eighteen years ago we bought it because of the garden and not the semi-derelict house. Just a thought. -
Message 16
Posted by PatP (U14831146) on Thursday, 7th April 2011
My daughter and her partner's first priority, like most kids in today's economic climate, was to get the best possible accommodation for the meagre amount they had to spend on a house. So the first and major criteria when choosing their first home, was getting the best possible internal specification for their money. The outside area/garden was very low on their list of priorities and they were happy to compromise on that. In truth, if I cast my mind back to my own first purchase, it had a dreadful concrete yard with absolutely nothing to recommend it and was entirely without sun. The garden for them is of low priority in their lives, but, being the interfering mother that I doubtless am, I would love to be able to do something with it, so that they can actually enjoy sitting outside in the summer, enjoying a BBQ, perhaps with friends, or just having something to work on, or sit in outside in our glorious summer months, while still enabling them to feel they are still working towards making their home nicer and improving its marketability (i.e. improving its value to enable them onto the next stage of the house 'ladder') I am currently looking to move at this time, and like you, the garden has absolute priority in the decision of what to buy. Luckily I have a great deal more money than my daughter to be able to accomplish that, and time to enjoy it
-
Message 17
Posted by Papa Nopsis (U14479902) on Thursday, 7th April 2011
so that they can actually enjoy sitting outside in the summer,Â
I have just vacated an Oil tank from outside the kitchen window, which is south facing and discover that the small area that it covered is the best protected area in the whole garden.
Even that would be enough to sit out in comfortably on an early spring or late autumn day, about 300x300. (3m x 3m). Getting the sun is an important matter for us in northern climes, and getting it in the yard or garden is best of all! -
Message 18
Posted by Paul N (U6451125) on Thursday, 7th April 2011
Pat
If the garden is a low priority for them, perhaps it should also be a low priority for you too? We have two grown up children. Our son inherited quite a nice mature garden and promptly asked me to rip out established shrubs and lay turf. I did as he asked but will not offer any more help. He has a small bed in his front garden with nine roses which he asks to rip out. I refused and have just pruned them. If he had his way he would concrete over everything. So sad. Our daughter has just brought her first small house in Twickenham and also has a nice garden. I removed a row of ugly Leylandii which brought light into the garden and spent a day there making new borders and moving plants in the wrong place. She and her husband enjoy the garden and spend a lot of time out there.
Some you win, some you lose
Paul -
Message 19
Posted by Papa Nopsis (U14479902) on Thursday, 7th April 2011
Some people would say I have crucified this garden over the last year or two. I have torn it to pieces with my bucket and spade, but I have a vision of what it will be like when I finish it, compared with what it was like when I started.
It will take me five years before I can sit down and not have much to do until the spring comes around again!
Gardens are all about visions and dreams, and some of us need to fulfil them! -
Message 20
Posted by crouchee (U13371975) on Thursday, 7th April 2011
Oooh, I wish I was oop north and could come and interfere! I love transforming a swine of a site with next to no budget. What access is there for soil out / materials in? Can't wait for the photos!
-
Message 21
Posted by PatP (U14831146) on Friday, 8th April 2011
A man (sorry 'person') after my own heart - I would just love to be there and 'interfere'
Get my spade into their garden and transform it into 'the hanging gardens' of Morley! I can envisage grand structures with walkways from the decking on the 'plateau' to a roof garden on top of the kitchen extension. If only there weren't 200 miles in between me and it!!! Thanks for sharing -
Message 22
Posted by Joe_the_Gardener (U3478064) on Friday, 8th April 2011
.............."You can spend as much building a garden as you can a house eh joe?"...........
Well yes, you can.... The only major differences between my tentative thought and a deck at ground level, which plenty of people have, are the extra costs of the long support posts, the stairway and a balustrade to stop people falling off.
Joe
About this Board
Welcome to the new Gardening Board. If this is your first time, then make sure you check out the
or  to take part in a discussion.
The message board is currently closed for posting.
Weekdays 09:00-00:00
Weekends 10:00-00:00
This messageboard is .
Find out more about this board's
Search this Board
Â鶹Éç iD
Â鶹Éç navigation
Â鶹Éç links
Â鶹Éç © 2014 The Â鶹Éç is not responsible for the content of external sites. Read more.
This page is best viewed in an up-to-date web browser with style sheets (CSS) enabled. While you will be able to view the content of this page in your current browser, you will not be able to get the full visual experience. Please consider upgrading your browser software or enabling style sheets (CSS) if you are able to do so.